The Ragnoutaz

Kick-ass Parisian electro-punk band not afraid to sing about the full experience of what it means to be a woman - their name is a viking war cry for 'There will be blood'. 

                                                                        Listen here

                                                      Website here

So first of all could you just tell me about how the band formed?

Zelda (lead vocals): It all started in the spring of 2011, me and Marion (on bass) wanted to compose music together just for fun. We would hang out at hers and use her and her girlfriend Marie 's recording gear (which was mainly their PC with Cubase and a mic).  Marie joined us shortly after on guitar and voila! we became a trio. It got suddenly more serious with Marie joining in and we played our first gig not so long after forming the band. I also need to add that , although we started out as a trio , we recently decided to have our friend Lea on drums to give more of a live feel to our drum machine samples, as she's an excellent drummer with great energy and intuition. 

Who are your main influences?  

They're very diverse. I for one love all sixties music : soul, early reggae, ska, rocksteady, and british beat, freakbeat, garage.. I also love late seventies/eighties punk, power pop, oi!. Bloody Mary loves a lot of classic rock n roll and also indus and post punk. Same goes for Lady M. who's a big fan of post punk,of glam and rock n roll in the general sens of the word, but who also loves soul and funk. 

When we compose for the Ragnoutaz, we "inject" slight touches of all these but without making it too obvious (whether it's through the bass line, my flow on lead vocals or aggro power chords by Mary) and then when the drum machine comes it's all wrapped up in something more poppy and somewhat electro. :)

 Have any of you experienced sexism in any form as a result of being women playing music?

We can all say we've experienced sexism for being female musicians MANY TIMES! Itthen will take different shapes and happen in different contexts. For instance, I play drums in a sixties beat/pop band and I've been told once, after a gig, that I did a great show but that I was an exception among female drummers because generally : "women can't drum! Even good ones are bad! They're clumsy and bad! and 50 years of rock history with no real good female drummer is clear evidence of that!!" . I then realised that this guy was trying the worst chat up line in the history of the universe...

Then, Lady M. and Mary often tell me stories of them going to a amp store or guitar store and being compleeeetely ignored for hours by all the male shop assistants. Then Mary also gets a lot of bullshit as she's also an excellent sound engineer and generally, at first glance, male musicians will not trust her. We've also heard a lot of bullshit form the same people who would have us play... what a shame.

Why do you think it is that female musicians experience this kind of prejudice so regularly?   I was reading an interview with Adele Bertei who was in the no-wave band The Contortions, and she was of the opinion that it comes from fear.  Would you agree with that or do you have a different perspective?

So our perspective on this is that we don't necessarily believe it's due to fear. We get the feeling it's more because of general lack of visibility of female musicians. When you start playing gigs and end up among a lot of male bands and musicians, you can sometimes feel you're being treated like a total newbie. Men love talking about their equipment , pedals, the size of their plectrums etc. and they don't want to share that with us cause they seem to think we have no clue what they're talking about. So most of the time they don't take us seriously as musicians, but when they see us on stage, or realize we can actually PLAY, they're like "wow you're good!". The funny thing is, it may also happen the guys who don't think you're not a skilled musician because of your gender are actually bad musicians themselves. Some of them are so full of shit and what's funny is that they never seem to question their capabilities. In general, people will expect more from female musicians. It's sort of like you need to prove you deserve this title.

 'Dance and Suffer' performed live at the Live festival Arthémise

How have you been received by the music press? 

We've been received quite well, but it's only been on webzines and blogs so far. But still it's been quite positive and we're super grateful! On the other hand, I suddenly started to get a lot of hate mail sent directly to the webzines and blogs, from the same person under different nicknames (but with the same IP address! haha!). We've tried to find out who it was but we reckon it might just be some angry ex of mine. ;)

Or somebody who's just jealous!  What advice would you give to all the young girls just getting into playing music now?

 
The advice we would give them is to start playing live as quickly as possible, especially if they're into rock n roll. Just getting on stage as often as possible, borrow a car once in a while (if one of them drives) and start going places. That's for me the best way of learning the ropes and getting better at your instrument as well! If they feel that there aren't enough opportunities to play, then why not organise their own events and invite bands over. It's also a great way to create a network. This is what we're doing with the Ragnoutaz and also through Bloody Mary and Lady M's association "Crache!" (which is also a fanzine, there Facebook page is here). The more we play, the more we meet awesome people and discover new sounds and simply the more we grow as individuals. And if you start getting in touch with a lot of all female bands as well, you realize slowly that you're not only creating a network  but also doing something for the cause : making it possible for awesome female musicians to get the visibility they deserve. 

The second piece of advice I would give is to get out there and do your thing without caring what people think. There will always be haters and bullshitters trying to put you down or patronize you, not only dudes but women as well. I remember playing at some club in Paris a long time ago with Lady M and I's former band the Sixtits (i was on drums back then) and while we were getting the gear up on stage, two chicks started playing around with our mics  and taking the piss out of us. Our lead singer Sab at the time got pissed off but stayed surprisingly calm and got the mics back from the two girls. Though when we hit the first song, she started singing at them with all her might and suddenly these two chicks realized they could not fuck with us. They then came to see us after the show to apologize. Women will sometimes be harsher than men towards other women and that really sucks.
 

Madeline Mondrala

New York-based artist creating experimental pop sounds

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So who are the biggest influences on your sound, and how would you describe your music?

This is a difficult question to answer because while I know who my favorite artists are and who I love to listen to, I don't know who comes through the most in my music.  I hope that no one artist in particular comes through. I think its the ambiguity of a lifetime of influence that makes a song interesting. Its not a conscious process. I can control what I listen to, but not how it rubs off on me.  There are a few artists who I deeply admire who I can only hope have added to my sound.  Bjork, Gwen Stefani (No Doubt years), Erykah Badu, Madonna, St. Vincent, and Joni Mitchell are all musical idols of mine.

I also listen to a lot of pop music like Taylor Swift, Katy Perry, and Beyonce who have all had a hand in the kind of music I create as well. I also go off on musical tangents all the time.  One week it will be classical indian singing, the next its random 80's albums.  I'm all over the place; the best place to be. 

I noticed there's a lot of musicians contributing to your EP!  Do you play gigs with a full band?
 

I worked with a lot of talented musicians on this EP, but my band only has four people.   It consists of me on keyboard and vocals, Matt Speno on guitar (he produced the EP), Brendon Caroselli on drums, and Jonathan Sacca on Bass. The live arrangement is similar but I didn't want to try to create an exact replica of the EP.  My band's arrangements are certainly influenced by the sound of the EP but its a different and unique expression of those songs.

As a female musican, have you experienced sexism in any shape or form?

I've made music with a lot of men throughout my life.  I've never felt particularly discriminated against.  Of course it was difficult at times to deal with rowdy teenage boys, especially at the tender age of 14, but I know how to command people's respect in a band setting.  The men in my band now have never disrespected me.  They love women.  They're wonderful men.

To look at things from a slightly different angle - and I'm asking this completely objectively because I've no idea of what you look like!  Do you think you have experienced any kind of reverse discrimination due to being a woman?  There's also a related phenomenon - which Chris Robley, writing for the website 'DIY Musician', described as 'Cute-girl dismissal syndrome', admitting that he has been guilty of it himself!  He defines it as the tendency to "discredit the talents of a woman (normally without ever hearing a note of her music) simply based on the fact that she’s attractive according to the standards of… yes, society– and you bitterly assume this affords her some unfair advantage"

I have actually. Last semester I took a Jazz Combo class. I felt like I had no voice in the ensemble even though I was the singer.  All the songs the instructor chose were from the male perspective and weren't in my vocal range.  I suggested songs I knew I could sing well but he never used any of them. Thats really the only stand out experience I can think of along those lines. I know there are downsides to being an attractive woman in the music industry, but more often than not its an advantage that I use to my own benefit.  I think as a woman in this industry its in your best interest to develop a sense of your own beauty and a knowledge of how to best present it, use it, and incorporate it into your art.

Discrimination as a women in music is hard to boil down to a list of specific experiences.  Its the kind of thing that hangs in the air.  Its on the level of pheromones and complex, subtle social cues.  Being a woman sets you apart in some ways when you're surrounded by a group of men. That just means its one more thing she has to learn to navigate.  Learning makes people smarter so I think being female has only helped me.

I get what you mean by that - one person I spoke to said that the bass player and drummer in her band were virtuosos, and they became like that because the constant discrimination meant that they had to work a lot harder at their instruments than they otherwise would have. 

Have you ever felt a pressure to sexualise yourself more than you otherwise would?

I suppose I have felt some societal pressure to look sexy onstage. Maybe when I was younger I bought into that mindset a bit more than I do now.  Now I personally want to look alluring onstage, but I do it in my own way.  I also want to look other ways on stage at the same time.  For example: quirky, interesting, original, stylish.  I try to balance it all out.

What would you say to a 15 year old girl just picking up an instrument now?

Find your own voice in music.  Do what makes you feel fulfilled in music.  Listen to the artists who inspire you. Play music that inspires you. Explore your own unique creativity.   If you love it, never stop, but take little breaks to remind yourself you love it.

 

Watch 'Blood Brother' video

Syren

Syren is the pseudonym for award winning singer-songwriter Erin Bennett. The name originally referred to the alternative/rock band, Syren of which Erin was the front-woman, guitarist and songwriter. However after death of Jo Heeley (Erin's wife and Syren drummer) and the retirement of bassist Amanda in early 2012, Erin reformed the band with an all new line-up and began a new approach to music under the Syren name. She describes their sound as 'definitely gay' pop-rock. The band are currently recording a new album which is due out in the summer, and you can catch them at the Big Burns Supper festival in Dumfries and Rainbow Kilts festival in the Borders.

Listen here

Syren website here

Erin Bennett website here

  
What are your influences?

In particular, Alanis Morissette and Heart, but there's a lot of Queen and Motown in there.

You've been playing for ten years. Have you experienced much sexism in that time?

In the very early stages, when I was a teenager, it was just [perceived as] really 'hot' that there was a teenage girl doing it – they were more attracted to the 'angst' than the music. Later on in my career, when I would do interviews, male journalists would sometimes try to finish my words for me. Almost like they try to tell you how they think you should fit into the music scene.

The thing about us (Syren's previous line-up), not to sound egotistical, but we were very good at what we did. Jo (drums) and Amanda (bass) were absolute virtuosos.  And they got that way from hours and hours of rehearsal. They were tired of being compared to men.

Once, during sound check, the sound engineer said 'Oh I just put a bit of bass in your monitor', and when I explained why I didn’t want any, they were patronising.  Some fans watching sound check even mentioned it to me afterwards, so I knew it wasn’t just me.  And there's been times when we were playing, I’d make hand signals for monitor changes (makes 'can I get more vocals in the monitor' gestures), and it wouldn’t happen. So I would stop playing, put my guitar down, walk off stage, go right behind the sound desk, change my levels and get back on stage to carry on.

I think, with some male sound techs, they have two issues. The first one is that you're women, and they unconsciously expect you to not know what you're doing, or what you need and the other is that a lot of sound people are musicians themselves, and they can get a bit jealous of the skill level. But I’ve also met some male sound techs who have been very accommodating and lovely.

How about back when you were learning guitar?

I taught myself to play when I was 14. I would often invent chords and styles of playing for my songs and guys would take my guitar from me and show me how ‘its meant to be done.’ I would never listen to them. I hate people telling me what to do.  At the end of the day (and not tooting my own horn) I’ve developed my own unique rhythmic style of playing. That was recognized by RainSong guitars who offered me an endorsement when I was 20. I’ve had many guys who have been a bit snarky because I don’t play ‘widdildy-diddildy’ like they do…surely they should have a deal?  But it isn’t about what you play, it’s about your skill level. Perhaps that isn’t strictly sexist, but I’ve never heard a bad or jealous word from a woman about it.

Have you noticed any positive changes since you started playing on the music scene?

I have noticed a difference, but it's only because MY attitude has changed. When I notice guys getting a bit territorial, or self-righteous, (sometimes in an unspoken way) I either just ignore them completely or say, ‘Okay then….you try and do it better’ I mean, I've had 'you're not bad for a girl', but no one has ever been verbally ‘abusive’ towards me. My approach to it now is a bit more aggressive. I refuse to give people the opportunity to treat me differently because I’m a woman.

As in zero tolerance?

Yeah, I mean, when I'm at home, I'm really very shy. But when I'm on stage I do not tolerate any shit from anybody, men or women. This is my sacred space. I don't let anybody tell me how to do my job.

These days my bass player is a man, and he's my producer as well. I'll write a song, and present it to him, and he's well aware of my aggressive, slightly moody way of doing things. We'll work together towards what's best for the song. I trust his judgement and opinions because I know that he doesn't care if you're a man, a woman, a fish or a giraffe. He just sees the music like a diamond that needs polishing. And that’s where his whole focus goes.

Watch 'Dehumanized' video

Have you ever felt a pressure to sexualise yourself on stage?

No, I've never felt pressured. It comes down to how people think about the music business. On one side of my character I’m a songwriter who is highly emotional and wants to be noticed and respected strictly for my songs. But on the other side, I want so badly to succeed in the music business (and it IS a business) that I look at what aspects of myself that I think will draw people in. Its like when you go to buy a car. The very first thing you notice is the car itself. How it LOOKS. That draws you in to find out more about it, how it performs, gas mileage, etc. So whether it’s my big knockers or big hair I base my philosophy on what Dolly Parton said, ‘If you got it, flaunt it’. I'm just taking the things that are most obvious about me, and making them louder in the mix.  I don’t care if men look at me and find me sexually attractive because I know that MY body and my soul and my heartbeat are for women. I want to empower women to recognise their strong points and not be afraid to utilize them. If a woman is good looking, she shouldn't have to hide it.

What would you say to a 16 year old girl just picking up a guitar now? 

It sounds like a cliché, but to stay true to yourself. And when I say ‘true to yourself,’ I don't mean what you think you SHOULD be – I mean who you are.  A lot of young girls (and older women, for that matter) feel pressured to look like the models and women from the television. Just be yourself, know what you want and let it burn in you, and don't let anybody take that away.

Watch 'Seasons' video

Spat

'Melodic pop-punk riot grrl' from the Scottish Borders. SPAT also organise band nights in Hawick, and are involved with the Borders LGBT festival 'Rainbow Kilts'.

Photos by Rafferty&Rafferty

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What's the music scene like in the Borders?

Haley (guitar/vocals): There's a lot of cover bands, but there's all these original bands who want to play in the Borders, or original bands from here but they don't get much chance to play.

So its a case of, if there's no scene you just create your own scene?

Yeah. If you write your own material they don't want to give you a gig, even if you don't want paid.  It seems more about money.  These places should give all bands a chance.

Tell us about some of the other bands in the Borders.

There's 'The Zenith Complex', they're on the same wavelength as us, and there's 'Veronica is Boring' (drummer Ryan's other band, which he describes as 'pirate metal'). There's the Honey Badgers - they're grunge rock, and there's 'Psychotropic System' (Korn/System of a Down-style metal).

How did the band form?

It was in 2004. There's a music charity called 'Trash Projects', and they wanted to get more female stuff going, and my friend Jenny asked me if I'd like to volunteer at a 'Girls with Guitars' project, that's where ains and I met Then we just got a band together...and fell in love (laughs)! We were called 'Broken Dolls' to start with. Angie joined in August last year and we played Rainbow Kilts, and then the Pussy Whipped festival.  We got in contact with Ryan through a friend and asked him if he would like to join Spat a few weeks later. Our old drummer was asked to leave because she didn't want to play 'gay gigs'.

Have you experienced much sexism?

Ainsley (guitar): There has been a couple of times over the years when people have looked at us funny, or spoken to us like they don't expect us to know what we're doing, but it has never gotten in the way and we just keep going. The majority of people are really helpful and its happening less and less now. 

Angie, you were a punk musician in the early 80s. What was it like back then?

I was in my first all-girl band in 1980 in Portland, Oregon. We were very challenging - I've been kicked out of bands for being a girl before. I've certainly experienced the glass ceiling in the music industry – where girl bands are the opening bands.

 What other bands have you been in?

Well there was 'The Braph Smears'..

So what's a Braph Smear?

It's German slang for the smear on a girls underwear - as I say we were very challenging! I got into straight-up hardcore and it got a little harder. I was in a band called 'Trash', and we were on P.E.A.C.E./War (early 80's compilation of 55 international hardcore bands), and only five or six of those bands had women in them, and I was in two of those! There weren't any women old or brave or interested enough to get involved. I had a zine called 'Pissed Off in Portland, Oregon', and I wanted to interview (pioneering hardcore band) Bad Brains but they said no , because I was a woman. My best friend was playing guitar and they said to her, 'you should be barefoot and pregnant'. Everybody thinks its so great that there's this black hardcore band, but I don't care if they're black or white, they were just hateful to everyone. That was sexism in the punk rock scene, at the highest level. 

  
How have you seen things change since then?

It was always like, yeah maybe we'll have a girl singer, but I was never into that. I was always ready to roadie, to manage. Now it's like there's no limits, there's plenty of support systems out there. You can totally go all round it, the barriers are much less than they used to be. There's always been enlightened men who can think beyond gender stereotypes, but back in the 80's, it was harder to find. You had to really really fight, every day. Now there's girls in bands everywhere.

Haley: we had a past band member who when he got in the band was full of pervy sexual innuendos and I think he thought he could get away with it because we were female! so we kicked him oot .

Ryan, how is it being the only guy in a band with a load of girls?

Its fine. Obviously being the drummer, I have the most to set up, and so people think I'm the drum tech or the guitar tech. They're like, 'I thought it was an all-girl band', I think because Spat's got an all-girl reputation. But I don't care, I just like playing music. I like hitting things.

Sabrina Chap

Sabrina Chap is a musical artist, cabaret performer and literary editor. Imagine a feminist burlesque Tom Waits with better piano skills and filthier lyrics and you're about halfway there. She has just released a new album , ‘We Are the Parade’ , as well as the second edition of her book 'Live Through This', a collection of essays and visuals on the 'bizarre entanglement of destructive and creative forces' that often plagues women artists.  Her website is here.

Throughout your musical career, have you ever felt like you were being treated differently than a male performer would be?

 

When I was in high school, the only other people who were doing creative things, playing in bands etc. were guys, and the only way to be a part of anything creative or cool they were doing was to date them. So you could only ever be on the periphery. Once, I remember, when I was on our high school’s speech team (which is like competitive theatre), I did better in this competition thing than the guy I was off and on dating. He was really pissed and hurt that I dared beat him, so I ended up feeling really bad about it. And I didn't even mean to beat him, I hadn't even thought that I was good enough, and then I wasn't even proud of myself when I won. 

  
I ended up going to college for music, and that was when I started creating a lot. I thought that – just because it was college, and we were all studying music, it would be a creative and vibrant place, but it wasn’t. Some girls invited me to be part of their sorority, and I was confused. I said, “I don’t want to be a part of a sorority, because the girls aren’t doing anything. If I’m going to join anything, it’d be Phi Mu Alpha”, which was the guy’s fraternity. Again, it was the guys doing all the creative stuff- getting together, geeking out about Stravinsky or chord changes. It was the boys getting together, creating for each other, sharing, encouraging one another. So I told a friend of mine that I wouldn’t consider the sorority, but would consider joining the fraternity, and he said, ‘Oh, the boys of Phi Mu Alpha would love it if you joined, Sabrina. They Really like you. They really like you.” , making it clear that they were all talking about me sexually. Again, it was obvious the only way to enter their creative community was to be sexualized. So I got pissed off. I purposefully gained a lot of weight and dyed my hair black, to make myself less attractive. It was like, 'you can't handle me pretty, so I won't be'.   In fact, any time I wanted to do creative stuff it was all guys doing it. I got sick of it Any time I went into Guitar Centre, I got hit on. It never ends. 

For this new album, I was studying big band charts for the first number, ‘When I Grow Up, I’m Gonna Dance'.  I hadn’t written music out since college and was excited to be studying scores again. I know this guy- older, about 65. He has been playing and arranging big band stuff for awhile. We were friends. I thought. I asked if I could buy him breakfast and then get his opinions on the scores I was working on. He didn’t really look at the scores, and offered me absolutely no advice. At the end, he made a nervous sexual advance towards me. I was heartbroken. Again- I had opened up creatively to a guy, and he hadn’t even looked at what I’d done. It made me doubt my own work.

 

This happens a lot.

It does, and it's unfortunate because then I self-censor myself. I have turned down a lot of possible collaborations because I have gotten used to understanding that they are tied in with something sexual. It always upsets me when it’s someone I hoped to consider a mentor. 

 

So it's like, women can't be involved in music, unless there's something sexual about it.

Well they can. I mean, some totally are. You just have to own it and define it yourself, which is partially why I think the burlesque thing has been such an empowering turn for me. Because that’s what they do up there. Own and define their own sexuality and notions of power, and then use it. Which is what you do best when you’re a confident rock star. But if you don’t do it- they’re gonna do it for you. But it does end up blocking my education sometimes. One of my biggest problems is learning the names of the gear, because you go to Guitar Centre, and they just hit on you, and then try and sell you the most expensive stuff. I never had friends just hanging out where we’d teach each other the names of the things we needed. Stupid names- like what is ‘a quarter inch cable’? What is a ‘monitor’. With sound engineers, they use all these technical names, and though I didn’t have the language for the technology, I still knew what sounded wrong or right. When a sound guy would be annoying, which didn’t happen often but did sometimes- they’d throw all this technical jargon in my face and I’d be like, “Maybe I don't know the names of that stuff, but I know I can't hear myself”. Some sound guys are just dicks to everyone, but I can't help thinking are they just being like that with me because I'm a woman? Or are these people just straight up dicks? At one point, I worked with this female sound engineer, and she told me what to say to them. She said, 'you need to tell them that you need a D.I. (direct input) box' and you need your vocals high in your monitor. That’s what you need to say. ‘

And did you notice a difference in the way she treated you?

Yes, definitely. There are some non-shitty male sound engineers, there are some great guys. Pete, the guy that does sound at Club Helsinki is incredible- and is also one of the few people who tried to teach me what I needed while we were doing soundcheck. There could be some shitty female sound engineers, but I've only worked with one female sound engineer this whole time. Melina Afzal at the Red Palace (aka the Palace of Wonders). But I think she ends up having trouble getting sound gigs, because she’s a woman. It’s a shitty cycle.

Mary Lou (Ladyfest Edinburgh organiser who is also in the room): When we were booking gigs for LadyFest, it was always male sound engineers.

 

'Never Been a Bad Girl' from first album 'Oompa!'

Sabrina - One of the main reasons I play on the burlesque scene so much is because there are a lot of female producers. A lot of them went up through the ranks from performing, so they know what it's like for female performers. The women in burlesque just now are just amazing, they are so on their shit, and they know how to treat people well. I've only had one or two not great experiences, and I think for a lone woman going into new cities all the time, that's a pretty good average. I played a gig last night – it was a very straight bar, it was guys playing rock music, and the guys in the band really liked me, so we all got really wasted after the set. It was all ok- they were nice as hell, but there were sexual undertones. There always are- especially when you’re wasted and on tour. They were totally nice, awesome guys- but the girl I was with at some point grabbed me and we walked away. I was wasted, she was wasted, and we both realized we needed to get out of there before the situation got out of control. And it was fun, but I don’t think I could do that every night, and that’s what rock bars – dude-centric bars- often encourage.

But in burlesque it's not like that, because everybody's looking out for each other. These people are either making their living doing burlesque, or have full on jobs besides. They’re responsible, on their game, and can’t get wasted because they have these intricate costumes they can’t fuck up. We’re crazy on-stage, but we have our shit together off. Or the good ones do- because we’re professional. I have a song called 'The Dirty Song', and I wrote it especially for burlesque, but it's sexually insane, and everybody just delights in it. I ended up playing it at the straight bar just to get a rise out of people and a girl came up to me after I'd played it and said 'thank you for playing that. You’re hilarious. You're batshit crazy, and it makes me feel normal'. But it’s an act. They don’t get that.

Most people probably wouldn't put the words 'feminist' and 'burlesque' together..

Well they probably just think it's about women taking their clothes off etc., but for me it's the most vibrant feminist scene that exists today. They’re mostly run by woman producers, performed my a majority of women performers who make their own costumes and decide how they want to portray their own sexuality and power, and the audiences are super respectful of the women performers because if they aren’t- they get thrown out. People really watch out for each other in burlesque. 

 

Watch Sabrina's gay pride-themed video for 'We are the Parade'!

Lake Montgomery

Folk blues storytelling singer-songwriter from Paris, Texas. 

Listen here

As a female musician, have you experienced much sexism?

Things like being kinda ignored, the soundman being surprised that I actually know something about the equipment. When I travel with a male friend of mine - we gig together a lot, I see first hand how he's treated differently. I've never labelled it as sexism, it could be because he's British. There's so many other reasons it could be; as an American, as a black girl. It's really hard to say why I'm being discriminated against.

Don't you get pissed off?

Not really, because there's so many assholes in the world, and I've experienced a lot of racism, but it's definitely different outside of Texas (where she's from). I'm just glad to know that you're a jerk, so I don't have to deal with you anymore. I appreciate when people show it to me immediately.

Have you found the recording studio environment to be a particularly male-dominated space?

I wouldn't really call it male dominated. I've worked with a male engineer and a female producer, so not really. But that's just my experience.

Have you had to put up with much sexist behaviour from audiences?

My crowds are like the coffee/tea crowds – laid back people, families etc. I think if I were more in a rock scene, I'd experience more of that. The worst experiences I've had have been in pubs, because there's guys drinking, but my songs are softer... I've been hit on etc., but I think that's gonna be normal when you're around a bunch of beer drinking guys.

How about when buying guitars and equipment in music shops?

Yeah, but again, I don't know if it's because I'm female. But yeah, they don't pay me much attention to me, or they point me towards the beginners guitars. When I'm talking about technical stuff, I see guys being pleasantly surprised.

"Like a Time Bomb", Out of the Bedroom, Edinburgh

How long have you been playing?

About 14 years.

So do you think that things are better now than when you started?

It's hard to say because I've moved around so much, but when I go back to Paris, Texas, I see that a majority of the racism has been replaced by curiosity. I remember this drummer from Curacao (very small country in South America). I introduced myself to him because I liked his playing. Apparently he said to his friend (before he had heard me play), 'well if she can't play she has a nice ass'. But it was a nice venue and I was playing with a good band, so he couldn't really realistically assume that I'd be shit, but he thought it was all about my ass, that I'd gotten there because of my looks. He'd say 'What are you? You have woman energy, you have man energy, you have to choose'. But that kind of macho thing, that comes from his (latin american) culture. He was afraid of losing the spotlight. He didn't like it when his name was not next to mine on the poster. We're not friends anymore, and when the decisive arguments happened, he said that I was a primadonna and I had too much male energy, stuff like that. That was always a big thing for him, my male energy vs my female energy. But maybe it's true, of course I have both. But he felt like he was competing with me, he wanted to be the man.

But you were the frontwoman...

Yeah, so he couldn't do it by himself. He couldn't just go on stage and play drums by himself.

If you had been a man, if you were Lloyd Montgomery, how would it have been different?

I feel like it would have been more equal, there would have been less confusion. But I might not have been able to charm him into the band in the first place. So maybe some of what he said was true, I do use female energy when it's beneficial to me, and male energy on stage.

I would call it empowered female energy.

Yeah, exactly. But these terms are too simple for the public, they really see it as male and female, black and white, circle and square. Empowered female energy is not simple enough for the general public.

But its about passivity rather than simplicity, people expect women to be passive.

Yeah, when people go for simplicity it is also them not accepting the full range of colours, as it were. So I think that it could be either/or.

Have you ever felt pressured to sexualise yourself on stage?

No, I'm not in that line of work. Maybe if I was more of a pop singer. But with the gigs I get, its more laid back. I don't have to encounter that pressure.

Who were your inspirations?

When I first started out my biggest inspirations were Kurt Cobain and Courtney Love, so I would do Nirvana and Hole covers. Then I got into the guitar playing of Jimi Hendrix, and Memphis Minnie..and Sister Rosetta Thorpe, she was an amazing guitarist. When I started getting a little better, people would say, 'you play guitar like a man'. I got that comment recently at a session here (in Edinburgh). I said 'so do you play guitar better than Bonnie Raitt?' (meaning that all men must play guitar better than all women). He was laughing, and he said 'she plays guitar like a man too'. I said 'I play guitar like a woman who plays guitar well'.

Did you not want to punch him?

If he'd said 'you play guitar like a white man' then I would have. But that illustrates that my experiences of discrimination are all rolled together. In this profession, I could be angry all day, but I choose not to be.

So you're saying, you're a black gay female musician so you could either be angry all the time, or forget it and try and have a nice life.

Yeah (laughs). But it's also my profession to be sociable and have as many fans as possible. I tend not to get angry at things people say. I know I'll never make a huge change, but I keep chipping away at the block. I say things that set people up for a new way of thinking. But I give a really long breakdown of why I don't sound like Tracy Chapman. I'm so tired of getting compared to Tracy Chapman! I have dreadlocks and I'm black so I must sound like her.

You don't sound like Tracy Chapman..

I know! So there are some things I get militant about. But I grew up forgiving people, I was raised Christian in small town Texas, in a racist environment. So I still think there's a place for that (forgiving people), but it's not just about forgiveness, it's about teaching by example. So I just believe in seeing the good in people rather than trying to demolish the bad in people.

 

The Spice Girls and Girl Power...empowering for young women?

Fiona, vocalist, Vatican Shotgun Scare  listen here

They were controlled by a svengali male, a band manufactured by men to get kids to part with their pocket money – which boils down to the exploitation of little girls to make money for men. If they'd been managed by a woman, that might have been more interesting. But I struggle with the way women are represented on MTV, either as performers or in videos - even if a song has a positive female message, sometimes its performed by someone dancing about in their pants! The way women are represented in these forms of media has to change, and I’m sure it will, if people keep complaining about it! But it seems to have gone the other way in recent years, we seem to be going backwards in that respect – everyone should see the film 'Miss Representation'!. [What would help is]..more encouragement for young women to take up instruments, and not just as an adornment, or as backing singers. But to keep up with the boys you have to be quite ballsy...and a lot of women are brought up to be passive, and I think that is reflected in music.. I haven’t seen any women on the X Factor shouting 'I wanna play bass', its all big ballads and stuff. But there is space for it, and more women are coming forward now. I guess if more women were involved in producing, and setting up labels... that will probably happen more in the future – there's more online courses and stuff now.

 Jane, drummer, Doll Fight!  website here

That’s an interesting and knotty question! It’s something Marisa Meltzer addresses in her book Girl Power: The Nineties Revolution in Music. It’s also something I considered in a presentation about the history of all-girl bands I made for the campers at Girls Rock Vermont 2011.  Meltzer says, if I remember correctly, that the Spice Girls had some empowering influence simply because they had a huge mainstream audience – when they shouted “girl power!”, they were heard by more people than perhaps will ever listen to, say, (influential Bikini Kill album) 'Revolution Girl Style Now'. The Spice Girls had a mass-appeal, pro-female message, no matter how shallow or profit-driven it may have been. Myself, as a punk musician, I don’t think that kind of manufactured, commercially driven and male-managed “girl band” would ever be allowed to bring a strong, modern and relevant feminist message to a mass audience. They’re co-opting and exploiting the female desire for empowerment through music -- girls were meant to buy their girl power in the form of Spice merch, after all. Sleater-Kinney sang back in 2000: “they took our ideas to their marketing stars / now I’m spending all my days at girlpower.com trying to buy back a little piece of me.” For me, that sums it up. Also, the identities which were manufactured for the individual women of the Spice Girls reinforced a lot of stereotypes about women. Firstly, women were infantilised as “girls”. Secondly, the different “flavours” or “models” of Spice Girl on offer were stereotypical and limiting. This only really matters because young girls were asked “which Spice Girl are you” –effectively pressuring girls to define their identity according to hair colour, perceived social class, or athleticism. The “Baby Spice” character reinforced female infantilism and passivity; the only woman of colour in the band was designated as “Scary”. To me, that’s pretty far from empowerment. Where was empowerment – and role models -- for young women in the form of Drummer Spice? Guitar Spice? Bass Spice?  Hey, they were playing in Sleater-Kinney! And setting up the global network of girls’ rock camps. To my mind, that’s where the real empowerment through music is at.

Sarah, vocalist/guitarist, The Fnords   website here

I think that the Spice Girls occured at the tail end of an upswing in feminist consciousness (or third wave feminism). This was after Riot Grrrl affected a swathe of teenage girls with an interest in the more 'alternative' end of popular culture. The whole 'Girl Power' thing was a slick bit of marketing for what was essentially a bland pop group with a rather tenuous grasp of feminist politics, and a penchant for style over content. As the 'Girl Power' sloganeering metamorphosed into the 'Ladette' movement, gender equality was used as an excuse for women to exploit themselves and their gender. At the time, it felt like Girl Power was the power to flash your tits in public after an evening of binge drinking. Which personally didn't strike me as particularly liberating. I was brought up to believe in gender equality - that was my notion of feminism. And the subsequent bleating of 'men are bastards' wasn't my experience either. I don't think that adolescent and pre-teen girls during the mid-1990s needed the permission of a bunch of half-arsed figureheads to tell them that it was cool to hang around with their female friends and that boyfriends weren't the be-all-and-end-all - I'm pretty sure that they'd figured it out for themselves. At the end of the day it was part of the death knell of notions of feminism in the popular media.